Adoption of a Thai national

[DawnHRD]

I'm in a rather unusual situation. My Thai boyfriend died in March, leaving his 5 year old son in my care. We had all been living together since the little boy was 2 & he considers me to be his Mum. I love him very much & want to adopt him. I've seen a lawyer about it, but the situation is rather complicated. The boy's mother is still (as far as we know) alive, although she has had no contact with him since my boyfriend removed him from her care at the age of 6 months.
My boyfriend was also estranged from his family, although I have met them since his death. They want me to legally adopt "my" son & have promised to help in any way they can
I have a document, signed by my boyfriend (about 2 years ago), basically giving me guardianship rights for his son. I've been told, that, in Thailand, no-one (including his birth family) can take him from me without a court case. However, I need to legally adopt him to get him a passport so that I can take him out of Thailand (for holiday or to live).
We don't know where the birth mother is (she was from another province) & although some people are trying to help me, it's going very slowly. I want to start adoption proceedings asap, but it's my understanding that I can't until the birth mother has signed him over to me.
Does anyone have any idea what my next step should be? I don't have loads of money to throw at this, unfortunately. I think the British Consulate should be my next port of call for help, but I really don't know. If anyone knows the law as regards this sort of thing, or has had any experiences like this, please let me know.
Thanks
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[prcscct]

About 6-7 years back, Dawn, my ex Thai wife and I were sponsoring a little girl here at the Pattaya Orphanage. At that time I looked into adoption proceedings just out of curiosity and things did not look favorable at all. Perhaps laws have changed, I don't know. Then:

1) Very difficult if both parents were not Thai. Forbidden if both were Farang.
2) Absolutely forbidden to take the child out of Thailand on a permanent basis, and months of red tape even for a short stay overseas.
3) Monthly visits to the home for the first 5 years by the social welfare people.

There was more but I forget.

I'm afraid much of the same bureaucracy and xenaphobia may still be in place.

Below is a link to the local organization that oversees the Pattaya Orphanage. Not to be mistaken with the Pattaya Orphanage Trust which is located in the UK. Search the site and I am sure you'll find some email addresses for the local staff and Director. They are good people over there and if you clearly explain what you want to do and ask their advice, I'm sure you'll get a response with some guidance. Pete

www.fr-ray.org

[PJG]

I am afraid that even with the Birth Mother's approval it is going to be a dificult and costly proceedure. My wife(Thai) and I looked a number of years ago into adopting a nephew and I am afraid that there is no alternative but to engage a good lawyer and go to court which means costs.

After you have legal custody in LOS you then have to start procedures for legal adoption in UK. This involves a visit by a social worker and having a case study done. The costs involved were about £1200.00 this was about 10 years ago. I know that at the moment adoption of Foreign children is not looked favourably upon as they prefer you to adopt a UK child.

Good luck anyway.

[DawnHRD]

Thank you both for your replies. Looks like the situation is even worse than I had feared. I had already heard that the fact I have been his mother for 3 years would not be taken into account. There's very little chance I will pass the Social Services requirements, either: I'll be 37 this year, I'm farang, I'm single (since my little one's father is dead - not my choice, believe me!) and I have no income, we don't draw salary from the dog center & my Mum supports us both on her savings. I'm screwed, aren't I ?
What happens to him if I can't adopt him & I'm forced, financially or otherwise to leave Thailand? Oh, Sh*%, what a mess.
_________________
"The question is not, can they reason? Nor, can they talk? But, can they suffer?" - Jeremy Bentham, philosopher, 1748-1832

Make a dog's life better, today! Find out how - go to www.headrockdogs.org

[prcscct]

No, you're not screwed, you have a problem and problems are there to be solved, not always easily though. You're also a spring chicken at 37 so don't get down on yourself over that either.

You're under no legal obligation to contact the boy's birth Mother, and you have already been given the blessing of your deceased commom law husband's family. The husband and family by the way, that the birth Mother apparently abandoned the child to.

Since everything seems to be negative concerning adoption, I would just stop it all if your further research shows it's impossible. Raise the boy the best you can and try to arrange your life to fit his the best that you can. This may mean you actually having to plan your life around residing full time in Thailand until he is grown. It may mean you have to leave him with someone, or in some place from time to time.

Or, and this may hurt, you have to determine if perhaps the best for the boy and for you is indeed to return him to his birth Mother or to his Father's family. They are Thai.

The only thing that may appear good to you about the last option is that the younger the boy, the better he will be able to adapt. At 5 is 100 times better than at 8 or 10 if you won't be the primary in his life. A very wise man once said "Give me a boy to raise between the ages of 4 and 8 and he'll be mine for life....." I forget who he was, but published a century or so ago. From experience on my side, he was spot on. After 8 it is very, very difficult to change a boy's thinking and habits to adapt to new authority figures and to bond with a new family.

I really personally hope Dawn that you can come to grips with all this, and I know that all the regular's on here will give you as much help as we can. Stay positive as if the boy see's that your "down", he will be too. Pete

[lomuamart]

Other than the above, there's not much I can suggest, except that I did once look into a situation for a Thai lady whose husband had deserted her some years before. I was told that all it takes in Thailand is for both parties to be apart for 6mths and the deserter to be untraceable(I think) and then the aggrieved party can file for divorce easily by him/herself.
I appreciate that your boyfriend is no longer with us, but that's one consideration with regard to the mother. Also bear in mind that one set of grandparents support your case - and never forget the influence of older people here. Desertion is frowned upon by the courts here as well.
You also have the father's intentions, in writing.
Certainly, your next step should be to contact the consulate. Unfortunately, there seems to me little point in throwing money at a lawyer here right now if The Embassy won't eventually agree with your requests.
I suppose all I'm able to do is agree with the other posters and always try to think positively. It might take some time, but there are definitely things in your favour.
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"I spent a lot of my money on booze, birds and fast cars - the rest I just squandered". George Best.

[tbuzzi]

Dawn, could his paternal grandparents obtain a passport for him? if so at least you will be able to take him back to the UK if you have letter from his father it should act as consent when entering the UK? Then I would do some petitioning once you have him in the UK. It may mean not actual adoption but guardianship which should work around the adoption legalities.
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Logic takes you from A - B Imagination takes you anywhere!

[DawnHRD]

Thanks again for everyone's advice. There's no way in my mind that he can go back to his Thai relatives. I don't want to go into the details publicly, but I'll tell any of you that have advised me if you pm me. Suffice it to say that for his sake, despite them being his natural family, his nationality & his culture, I don't think it's best for him That's not my ego or selfishness talking, I have very good reason to feel this, and all of his friends in HH (my boyfriend's, not my son's!) feel the same.

Yes, I will go to the Consulate & take him with me. Perhaps if they see the bond between us, they'll help?? And perhaps I'm being very naive.

I agree with you all that keeping positive is the best thing for him & me. He does see when I'm upset & feels it very clearly. I don't do it often, promise! But it isn't fair on him, when he doesn't know or understand what's going on.

Thanks sincerely for your help & support
_________________
"The question is not, can they reason? Nor, can they talk? But, can they suffer?" - Jeremy Bentham, philosopher, 1748-1832

Make a dog's life better, today! Find out how - go to www.headrockdogs.org

[PJG]

Dawn,

Not sure if there is a compassionate entry visa for the UK (unless you are an Afgan refugee) but certainly go speak to the Embassy. Make sure you speak to a consul not one of the locally recruited staff.

If that route fails have you thought about helping him by paying for his stay in a good Orphanage. Perhaps there are some Christian Orphanages in Bangkok who would be sympathetic especially if you are able to offer some financial support.

[pasathai]

contact the thai dwp ( dept of public welfare)

they are very helpful if they know your situation/

255 rachavithi rd

bkk fax 662 247 5084

be ready for several months of " paper work"

( and some tea money helps)

[Sultry]

I can't offer you any advice. I just want to wish you and your boy good luck. I hope that everything will work itself out *hugs*
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It's a small world after all...

[DawnHRD]

Thanks everyone. Going to take him to the British Consulate as soon as I can & I will make sure I only speak to a consul.
Thanks for the address, Pasathai - my Thai is horrendous, do they speak English or will I need someone to get in touch for me?
As I said before, I really appreciate everyone's good wishes & support. I'll just keep my fingers (& everything else) crossed that everything works out.
_________________
"The question is not, can they reason? Nor, can they talk? But, can they suffer?" - Jeremy Bentham, philosopher, 1748-1832

Make a dog's life better, today! Find out how - go to www.headrockdogs.org

[Jaime]

[pasathai]